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Anthony
Hi. Anyone out there ever installed duals on their V twin tractors. Either Briggs or Kawasaki? Please don't ask why, either. I guess because I can. Just an object of interest with me I guess. blink.gif
Xyrian
The following post does not exist, as making any changes to anything for any purpose would not have been taken into consideration by the engineers of your equipment for the purposes of functionality, safety and retail mark-up. Fictional musings about theoretical topics having no basis in reality should not be taken seriously and therefore should have no liabilities intentional or implied attached.

Duals and triples are optional on 4WD articulated-steer tractors like Steiners, so you should easily be able to scrounge up parts to solve the problem or you can make up something yourself. Those are articulated tractors though. I know I've seen some lawn tractors with duals a few times, but my first thought when I read your inquiry was 'understeer'. You might need to space the inner rear tires out from the tractor frame a bit and/or add some weights to the front of the tractor. If you keep turf tires on the front and put dual bar-tread tires on the back, I think it'll want to just push the steer tires. I'm not sure what options you may have for front tires to get better steering bite.

The Steiner dual setup consists of inner wheels that bolt onto an axle hub (4-bolt as I recall) and the wheels have a pretty deep offset for the dish. Set into the deeper side of the wheels, square boxes with a round rod running through the center are bolted to the dishes. The outer wheels have a box/hub that slips into (or over...I forget which) the boxes on the inner wheels to align the duals. Pipes extend out through the centers of the duals' hubs. The inner ends of those pipes are threaded and have hook ends (flat steel bent around, like the hook on a ratchet strap) which grab onto those round rods on the inner wheels. You simply insert a tool into holes drilled in the outer ends of those pipes and turn them to draw the duals up tightly. With that setup you can very easily and quickly install or remove the duals. It's much like the clamp-on dual system on some larger tractors, but has just the one hook to tighten in the center instead of several hooks positioned around the edge of the wheel. Something like that might be the easy way to do it.

Doing it myself, I might want to fabricate two-piece hub extensions. The inner piece would attach to the tractor hub and space the inner wheel out from the tractor a little extra. The inner wheel and second piece of the extension would slide onto studs and be secured nice and snug with lug nuts. Then the duals would be bolted onto a flange hub on the outer piece of extension. My only concern with that is extra lateral stress on the tractor's hub and axle flex with the extra leverage the duals provide. It might help to change wheels at the same time. Go with taller and narrower rear wheels with bar-tread tires and find a combination of front wheels with some kind of ribbed tires (or bar tread tires for 'fake MFWD') so the thing will still steer nicely.

If you get this project done and still don't feel like it's 'tractor enough' yet, cut a couple holes in the hood and run vertical intake and exhaust pipes in that absolutely perfect manner so that they obstruct your forward view no matter which way you lean. wink.gif (Really, don't do that -- you'll burn yourself or inhale tractor smoke or have your cigarette smoke sucked into the air filter or you'll run over the neighbor's cat because you didn't see it or something. Then the lawsuits start. So, you didn't hear any of this from me. Really. Who, me? Nope, never. I never had any ideas to present for a scenario in a question you never asked.)

Oh yeah. Disclaimer:
Any modifications made to any piece of equipment by yourself, amateurs, professionals, trained monkeys, et al., may void the original equipment manufacturer's warranty. Modifications either directly mentioned or implied may make the affected equipment unsafe to the operator, bystanders, furry woodland creatures, pets, vermin, the environment and such danger may extend to others not expressly listed here. Adding traction to the mentioned equipment may result in the machine flipping. Dual tire combinations should not be considered as equipment intended to prevent roll-over of the machine. Install a tested and certified Roll Over Protective Structure and seat belt to protect yourself from tipping or roll-over. If the OEM did not provide a ROPS as original equipment, you're SOL. I didn't do it. Refer to the operator's manual for correct operation and maintenance of the equipment. The author of this post, the moderators of this electronic forum, the owners of the server this electronic forum is hosted on, people who have read the post, and any people who have bookmarked/forwarded/copied/distrubuted this post are not responsible for the actions taken by anyone anywhere anytime anyplace who may act on any suggested or implied modifications of any equipment. If buying more tires to put on your tractor causes global warming, don't blame me or anyone else previously mentioned or implied in this disclaimer or anyone other than the person directly responsible for wanting the extra tires installed.
Anthony
QUOTE(Xyrian @ Jun 25 2007, 12:47 AM) *
The following post does not exist, as making any changes to anything for any purpose would not have been taken into consideration by the engineers of your equipment for the purposes of functionality, safety and retail mark-up. Fictional musings about theoretical topics having no basis in reality should not be taken seriously and therefore should have no liabilities intentional or implied attached.

Duals and triples are optional on 4WD articulated-steer tractors like Steiners, so you should easily be able to scrounge up parts to solve the problem or you can make up something yourself. Those are articulated tractors though. I know I've seen some lawn tractors with duals a few times, but my first thought when I read your inquiry was 'understeer'. You might need to space the inner rear tires out from the tractor frame a bit and/or add some weights to the front of the tractor. If you keep turf tires on the front and put dual bar-tread tires on the back, I think it'll want to just push the steer tires. I'm not sure what options you may have for front tires to get better steering bite.

The Steiner dual setup consists of inner wheels that bolt onto an axle hub (4-bolt as I recall) and the wheels have a pretty deep offset for the dish. Set into the deeper side of the wheels, square boxes with a round rod running through the center are bolted to the dishes. The outer wheels have a box/hub that slips into (or over...I forget which) the boxes on the inner wheels to align the duals. Pipes extend out through the centers of the duals' hubs. The inner ends of those pipes are threaded and have hook ends (flat steel bent around, like the hook on a ratchet strap) which grab onto those round rods on the inner wheels. You simply insert a tool into holes drilled in the outer ends of those pipes and turn them to draw the duals up tightly. With that setup you can very easily and quickly install or remove the duals. It's much like the clamp-on dual system on some larger tractors, but has just the one hook to tighten in the center instead of several hooks positioned around the edge of the wheel. Something like that might be the easy way to do it.

Doing it myself, I might want to fabricate two-piece hub extensions. The inner piece would attach to the tractor hub and space the inner wheel out from the tractor a little extra. The inner wheel and second piece of the extension would slide onto studs and be secured nice and snug with lug nuts. Then the duals would be bolted onto a flange hub on the outer piece of extension. My only concern with that is extra lateral stress on the tractor's hub and axle flex with the extra leverage the duals provide. It might help to change wheels at the same time. Go with taller and narrower rear wheels with bar-tread tires and find a combination of front wheels with some kind of ribbed tires (or bar tread tires for 'fake MFWD') so the thing will still steer nicely.

If you get this project done and still don't feel like it's 'tractor enough' yet, cut a couple holes in the hood and run vertical intake and exhaust pipes in that absolutely perfect manner so that they obstruct your forward view no matter which way you lean. wink.gif (Really, don't do that -- you'll burn yourself or inhale tractor smoke or have your cigarette smoke sucked into the air filter or you'll run over the neighbor's cat because you didn't see it or something. Then the lawsuits start. So, you didn't hear any of this from me. Really. Who, me? Nope, never. I never had any ideas to present for a scenario in a question you never asked.)

Oh yeah. Disclaimer:
Any modifications made to any piece of equipment by yourself, amateurs, professionals, trained monkeys, et al., may void the original equipment manufacturer's warranty. Modifications either directly mentioned or implied may make the affected equipment unsafe to the operator, bystanders, furry woodland creatures, pets, vermin, the environment and such danger may extend to others not expressly listed here. Adding traction to the mentioned equipment may result in the machine flipping. Dual tire combinations should not be considered as equipment intended to prevent roll-over of the machine. Install a tested and certified Roll Over Protective Structure and seat belt to protect yourself from tipping or roll-over. If the OEM did not provide a ROPS as original equipment, you're SOL. I didn't do it. Refer to the operator's manual for correct operation and maintenance of the equipment. The author of this post, the moderators of this electronic forum, the owners of the server this electronic forum is hosted on, people who have read the post, and any people who have bookmarked/forwarded/copied/distrubuted this post are not responsible for the actions taken by anyone anywhere anytime anyplace who may act on any suggested or implied modifications of any equipment. If buying more tires to put on your tractor causes global warming, don't blame me or anyone else previously mentioned or implied in this disclaimer or anyone other than the person directly responsible for wanting the extra tires installed.

Thanks for the detailed answer, but i was refering to dual exhaust, not tires. Just a curious question as to how it effects performance, and how it sounds. My guess is pretty good. Sound, that is. Those V twins probably sound excellent. rolleyes.gif
Xyrian
OH. Well, that's kind of....a different topic. I'm still doing some tweaking on my '39 B which now has a custom manifold featuring dual exhaust and that sounds good too. Also a different topic, I guess.

Anyway, it shouldn't be too tough to fix something up by way of dual exhaust. You may have some issues finding a good place to route pipes depending how you want it to look and what modifications you're willing to do to the tractor (cutting body panels, moving wiring, etc...). I've seen several garden pulling tractors with dual exhaust. Many go right up through the hood with the pipes, some put them out the sides. I don't know what gains you'll really see without making any modifications to the engine and intake. If this tractor is still going to mow lawns, I'd caution that straight pipes won't have heat shielding or spark arresting properties that the stock muffler would have. Dry grass clippings and leaves would pose a fire hazard in that case.

If you do an internet search for garden tractor pulling, you'll find a bunch of clubs and websites that can help with tips and part links. I even found a neat page with a chart for Cub Cadets that recommended gear ratios and tire size to use for different levels of boost from a supercharger. YEA!

Good luck tweaking your project.
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